Drive Belt Experiences- All Models

Started by NMKawierider, March 30, 2016, 05:37:05 PM

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Ukhozi

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Ukhozi
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Zforce 550EX

Very different from the 500 and 800.

I know it says "change the belt every 3K but really, that gets expensive along with the other 38 thing you are supposed to do every 3K, theses are certainly NOT low maintenance machines. We do the oil and filter and clean the ait filter and replace that when it gets too dirty, depends on the conditions.

We have vehicles with over 11,000 km on now and drive belts are 'blowing up' at about 9 to 11K.
Changing the belt is a pain on the Z550 but still a couple of hours or so.

The Z550 does not have a clutch, at all, it relies on the slack belt being 'picked up' by the variator (front driving pulley) which in turn turns the rear (driven pulley).

While you are buying the belt buy half a dozed 8mm plastic rivets, you may need new ones, always good to have anyway.



First remove the seats and plonk them on the roof out the way.

The battery cover has to be removed and the cooling tube disconnected from it's rubber connector, had that connector been 2" longer to the rear where it leaves the engine this would not be needed but there just isn't enough room between the battery bracket and the pipe to extract the CVT cover.

Remove the inlet panel between the seats and then the panel behind the seats over the seat  belts and handbrake then the box under the left seat, bit of a pull but it does pop out.

Remove the large nut on the rear pulley, do NOT touch the front one at all and anyone can tell me how the hell the front one comes off after removing the left hand threaded bolt, let me know, they are SOLID!

After removing all the crap from the pulleys and engine case and the fluff from the CVT case, (after undoing the inner shields), screw in a M6 x 50 bolt into the one and only threaded hole in the rear pulley (there is a blank one (why?)) and expand it as far as possible, slip the new belt over the front and then the rear, there is no stress, Remount the rear pulley on the shaft and fit the big nut.

Just need to get the bugger back together then. A little light spray 3 in 1 or such on the fan tube makes it pop back on easier.

Hope that helps as the manual is both vague and not very helpful.

punsikorn

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Checked the belt on my CF500 at 2,000Km and looked like new. Have not done enough on my V5 scootercycle to be worth looking yet.
gclub

murdo

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I have a V5 and cf500 too, and am pretty sure they use the same belt.

jungle

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I have a 2017 800 trail, was going thru some pretty deep water,(my butt got wet deep), and after about 30' I could tell it was starting to slip. Figured it was water getting into the CVT. Kept on riding, seemed to get better, would just take a little bit to get up to speed, I would take it easy to not to squeal the belt. Kept riding for about another 3 hours, few more puddles, of course. When I got home, removed the clear little plug and also the small drain bolt, nothing came out. Question is, do you think it was actually water in there and it just dried up or could there be something else? Thanks.

Jim
Personalized rock sliders, roof chop, roof, and front bumper. Aluminum skid plate and front CV protectors. CVT blower.

murdo

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After a dipping I always take the cover off and clean out the pulleys and the housing. Suggest you do the same to make sure of no problems.

NMKawierider

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Quote from: murdo on February 20, 2020, 11:54:37 PM
After a dipping I always take the cover off and clean out the pulleys and the housing. Suggest you do the same to make sure of no problems.
Right and also, just because you can't hear it slipping...ie squealing, doesn't mean it isn't glazing the belt or grinding the wee wee out of the pulleys. You get water in there you need to stop, drain and run it in neutral at about 23-2500 RPM to blow-dry it before applying power to it again. Like murdo says, you need to pull the cover and inspect and clean everything. 
2015 Z Force 800 53/Trail EPS
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage |7- 9.7" GPS Systems | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front | Cage Chop Mod

My Videos On YouTube

paulp

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Thanks all, Low hanging fruit question;
Can anyone direct me to a u-tube (not in latvian) that shows the steps to replace the cvt belt? Love to see one done in entirety on either a 2020 500 or 2019 600 2up, or if they are all the same then even better!
Either utube or a decent manual someplace!
Thanks all once again!


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Quote from: NMKawierider on June 14, 2016, 09:53:54 PM
Quote from: locknload on June 14, 2016, 09:35:43 PM
Ya I had no idea they were that expensive when I bought my machine, I am going to get a spare so maybe I will look into that one also. I also asked both dealerships about tools so I can torque my clutches cause I haven't had time to make any and they both told me they impact them on cause cf moto doesn't supply any clutch tools for removal or installation!!!!!  The place I bought it from said they were able to modifiy a tool they use for the can ams, interesting!  China needs to step up their game
They do too have spanner wrenches...now finding them here might be tricky but I made my own like several others here have. And they have standard nuts..I think the Secondary is 36mm and the primary is 32mm. You can get those at Harbor Freight.  They are both right-hand threaded and require 80ftlbs torque. Most any 1/2" drive torque wrench works just fine. But to just change the belt you just have to pull the cover, use one of the cover bolts on the threaded spreader hole on the secondary, pop the old one off and the new one on...remove bolt and reassemble.

DO know however sometimes that secondary nut is rusted to the secondary spindle and is a MoFo to break loose the first time. It tool Heat, many choice words, a massive spanner and a 1000ftlb air impact to get mine off. But most aren't that way.

Just put a clutch kit in my uforce 1000 this weekend.  Need an a18mm, 30mm and a 32 mm socket.  An m6X1.00 by about 50mm in length to spread the secondary if you want the belt off.


574cfmotorider

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zforce500 with 650 miles.  I just inspected my belt as I am reclocking and it's already below its service limit!!!  I would say I have a pretty conservative riding style....I go to a lot of off road parks, but I always climb hills in 4 low, when going through mud or a bunch of sand its in low or 4 low (try to keep it out of low when speeds exceed 25mph for any duration).  I try to vary the throttle when wide open for periods.  Never been stuck, never smelled clutch burn.  I have taken the cover off and cleaned dust out twice already with compressed air.  The only thing I wonder being the culprit is heat maybe?  I currently have no temp gauge or fan in there.  Thoughts?

NMKawierider

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Quote from: 574cfmotorider on August 22, 2021, 09:20:30 AM
zforce500 with 650 miles.  I just inspected my belt as I am reclocking and it's already below its service limit!!!  I would say I have a pretty conservative riding style....I go to a lot of off road parks, but I always climb hills in 4 low, when going through mud or a bunch of sand its in low or 4 low (try to keep it out of low when speeds exceed 25mph for any duration).  I try to vary the throttle when wide open for periods.  Never been stuck, never smelled clutch burn.  I have taken the cover off and cleaned dust out twice already with compressed air.  The only thing I wonder being the culprit is heat maybe?  I currently have no temp gauge or fan in there.  Thoughts?
In most cases service limit means width and length of a belt. Heat, loading and over-clocking cause stretching in most cases. As for belt width, pure wear is mostly at play. The majority of that comes from either abrasive particles being introduced between contract areas of the belt and clutch...as in dust and dirt, slippage between the those same two surfaces..which can happen lots with just stop-n-start or very slow driving or the introduction of something like water or oil that causes slippage. This also causes glazing or burning of the belt and noticeable marking on the sheaves. There are other factors that cause these but these are the most common. I will say that for me, dust was my clutch killer. In the first 500 miles not only had my belt lost almost half it's service width, but the secondary's helix ramp pads were shot as well as my new sliders lost almost 1/16 a gram each...and they had only been in there for a few hundred miles.  I then moved and filtered it's incoming air...and although it has been a major PITA because it plugs-up very quickly, all wearing had been reduced to..well let's say at last inspection which was over 300 miles ago and 1200 miles sense I started filtering it, there has been almost no change in the belt width..like .0020.., no change in weight of the sliders and the new pads still look like a set that I would say has normal ramp travel. So clearly for me out here in dust-country it's all the trash that gets pumped through the CVT system. The odd part was.. these have the intake behind the driver's seat originally, not where you would thing it would get a lot of junk. But...apparently it gets a lot more then we know back there. Look ate the helix ramps and the pads for marks and wear and in the roller/slider tracks for build-up on the ends. This is an indicator of wear from abrasive particle ingestion. 
2015 Z Force 800 53/Trail EPS
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage |7- 9.7" GPS Systems | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front | Cage Chop Mod

My Videos On YouTube

574cfmotorider

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Quote from: NMKawierider on August 22, 2021, 10:15:52 AM
Quote from: 574cfmotorider on August 22, 2021, 09:20:30 AM
zforce500 with 650 miles.  I just inspected my belt as I am reclocking and it's already below its service limit!!!  I would say I have a pretty conservative riding style....I go to a lot of off road parks, but I always climb hills in 4 low, when going through mud or a bunch of sand its in low or 4 low (try to keep it out of low when speeds exceed 25mph for any duration).  I try to vary the throttle when wide open for periods.  Never been stuck, never smelled clutch burn.  I have taken the cover off and cleaned dust out twice already with compressed air.  The only thing I wonder being the culprit is heat maybe?  I currently have no temp gauge or fan in there.  Thoughts?
In most cases service limit means width and length of a belt. Heat, loading and over-clocking cause stretching in most cases. As for belt width, pure wear is mostly at play. The majority of that comes from either abrasive particles being introduced between contract areas of the belt and clutch...as in dust and dirt, slippage between the those same two surfaces..which can happen lots with just stop-n-start or very slow driving or the introduction of something like water or oil that causes slippage. This also causes glazing or burning of the belt and noticeable marking on the sheaves. There are other factors that cause these but these are the most common. I will say that for me, dust was my clutch killer. In the first 500 miles not only had my belt lost almost half it's service width, but the secondary's helix ramp pads were shot as well as my new sliders lost almost 1/16 a gram each...and they had only been in there for a few hundred miles.  I then moved and filtered it's incoming air...and although it has been a major PITA because it plugs-up very quickly, all wearing had been reduced to..well let's say at last inspection which was over 300 miles ago and 1200 miles sense I started filtering it, there has been almost no change in the belt width..like .0020.., no change in weight of the sliders and the new pads still look like a set that I would say has normal ramp travel. So clearly for me out here in dust-country it's all the trash that gets pumped through the CVT system. The odd part was.. these have the intake behind the driver's seat originally, not where you would thing it would get a lot of junk. But...apparently it gets a lot more then we know back there. Look ate the helix ramps and the pads for marks and wear and in the roller/slider tracks for build-up on the ends. This is an indicator of wear from abrasive particle ingestion.

Two of the helix pads seam pretty worn.  Can I unscrew the other ones and move them around into where the worn ones are?  The belt that came from the factory says Carlisle on it, the new one from cfmoto says mitsuboshi, maybe it will last a bit longer?  I am clocking from B1 to C1.  Thanks for your youtube video on this, it helped a bunch.  I am having issues taking the primary rear sheave off, I've just decided to leave it on though.  I cleaned the surface and used a bit of red scotchbrite and brakekleen.  I tried an 8" puller but couldn't get the puller "arms" behind the clutch due to clearance.  I'm also waiting for a new part to get the helix back on, I was using a hacked up hole saw but it's not working for reassembly so I bit the bullet and ordered something.

NMKawierider

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Quote from: 574cfmotorider on August 22, 2021, 11:42:48 AM
Quote from: NMKawierider on August 22, 2021, 10:15:52 AM
Quote from: 574cfmotorider on August 22, 2021, 09:20:30 AM
zforce500 with 650 miles.  I just inspected my belt as I am reclocking and it's already below its service limit!!!  I would say I have a pretty conservative riding style....I go to a lot of off road parks, but I always climb hills in 4 low, when going through mud or a bunch of sand its in low or 4 low (try to keep it out of low when speeds exceed 25mph for any duration).  I try to vary the throttle when wide open for periods.  Never been stuck, never smelled clutch burn.  I have taken the cover off and cleaned dust out twice already with compressed air.  The only thing I wonder being the culprit is heat maybe?  I currently have no temp gauge or fan in there.  Thoughts?
In most cases service limit means width and length of a belt. Heat, loading and over-clocking cause stretching in most cases. As for belt width, pure wear is mostly at play. The majority of that comes from either abrasive particles being introduced between contract areas of the belt and clutch...as in dust and dirt, slippage between the those same two surfaces..which can happen lots with just stop-n-start or very slow driving or the introduction of something like water or oil that causes slippage. This also causes glazing or burning of the belt and noticeable marking on the sheaves. There are other factors that cause these but these are the most common. I will say that for me, dust was my clutch killer. In the first 500 miles not only had my belt lost almost half it's service width, but the secondary's helix ramp pads were shot as well as my new sliders lost almost 1/16 a gram each...and they had only been in there for a few hundred miles.  I then moved and filtered it's incoming air...and although it has been a major PITA because it plugs-up very quickly, all wearing had been reduced to..well let's say at last inspection which was over 300 miles ago and 1200 miles sense I started filtering it, there has been almost no change in the belt width..like .0020.., no change in weight of the sliders and the new pads still look like a set that I would say has normal ramp travel. So clearly for me out here in dust-country it's all the trash that gets pumped through the CVT system. The odd part was.. these have the intake behind the driver's seat originally, not where you would thing it would get a lot of junk. But...apparently it gets a lot more then we know back there. Look ate the helix ramps and the pads for marks and wear and in the roller/slider tracks for build-up on the ends. This is an indicator of wear from abrasive particle ingestion.

Two of the helix pads seam pretty worn.  Can I unscrew the other ones and move them around into where the worn ones are?  The belt that came from the factory says Carlisle on it, the new one from cfmoto says mitsuboshi, maybe it will last a bit longer?  I am clocking from B1 to C1.  Thanks for your youtube video on this, it helped a bunch.  I am having issues taking the primary rear sheave off, I've just decided to leave it on though.  I cleaned the surface and used a bit of red scotchbrite and brakekleen.  I tried an 8" puller but couldn't get the puller "arms" behind the clutch due to clearance.  I'm also waiting for a new part to get the helix back on, I was using a hacked up hole saw but it's not working for reassembly so I bit the bullet and ordered something.
You can move them around and it may help even-up the wear. Do polish them up and the ramps as well though...polishing compound not sand paper. After doing so I rub-on a little coat of weapons grade graphite and lightly blow-off any loose or excess...you don't want any of that anywhere near the belt...lol. Others have had problems getting that rear sheave off too. I don't have an answer as it should just slide off per the looks of the parts breakdown. Don't use an outside puller...maybe there is a special puller for it. Check the service manual. I never heard of CFM using a Carlisle belt...only Mitsuboshi. Most of us now use either Ultimax or Gates for replacements as the OE belts are way over priced. Interesting note- from what I've been told, Timken bought Carlisle's belt division...made some changes and renamed it "Ultimax"
2015 Z Force 800 53/Trail EPS
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage |7- 9.7" GPS Systems | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front | Cage Chop Mod

My Videos On YouTube

574cfmotorider

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Quote from: NMKawierider on August 22, 2021, 12:23:19 PM
Quote from: 574cfmotorider on August 22, 2021, 11:42:48 AM
Quote from: NMKawierider on August 22, 2021, 10:15:52 AM
Quote from: 574cfmotorider on August 22, 2021, 09:20:30 AM
zforce500 with 650 miles.  I just inspected my belt as I am reclocking and it's already below its service limit!!!  I would say I have a pretty conservative riding style....I go to a lot of off road parks, but I always climb hills in 4 low, when going through mud or a bunch of sand its in low or 4 low (try to keep it out of low when speeds exceed 25mph for any duration).  I try to vary the throttle when wide open for periods.  Never been stuck, never smelled clutch burn.  I have taken the cover off and cleaned dust out twice already with compressed air.  The only thing I wonder being the culprit is heat maybe?  I currently have no temp gauge or fan in there.  Thoughts?
In most cases service limit means width and length of a belt. Heat, loading and over-clocking cause stretching in most cases. As for belt width, pure wear is mostly at play. The majority of that comes from either abrasive particles being introduced between contract areas of the belt and clutch...as in dust and dirt, slippage between the those same two surfaces..which can happen lots with just stop-n-start or very slow driving or the introduction of something like water or oil that causes slippage. This also causes glazing or burning of the belt and noticeable marking on the sheaves. There are other factors that cause these but these are the most common. I will say that for me, dust was my clutch killer. In the first 500 miles not only had my belt lost almost half it's service width, but the secondary's helix ramp pads were shot as well as my new sliders lost almost 1/16 a gram each...and they had only been in there for a few hundred miles.  I then moved and filtered it's incoming air...and although it has been a major PITA because it plugs-up very quickly, all wearing had been reduced to..well let's say at last inspection which was over 300 miles ago and 1200 miles sense I started filtering it, there has been almost no change in the belt width..like .0020.., no change in weight of the sliders and the new pads still look like a set that I would say has normal ramp travel. So clearly for me out here in dust-country it's all the trash that gets pumped through the CVT system. The odd part was.. these have the intake behind the driver's seat originally, not where you would thing it would get a lot of junk. But...apparently it gets a lot more then we know back there. Look ate the helix ramps and the pads for marks and wear and in the roller/slider tracks for build-up on the ends. This is an indicator of wear from abrasive particle ingestion.

Two of the helix pads seam pretty worn.  Can I unscrew the other ones and move them around into where the worn ones are?  The belt that came from the factory says Carlisle on it, the new one from cfmoto says mitsuboshi, maybe it will last a bit longer?  I am clocking from B1 to C1.  Thanks for your youtube video on this, it helped a bunch.  I am having issues taking the primary rear sheave off, I've just decided to leave it on though.  I cleaned the surface and used a bit of red scotchbrite and brakekleen.  I tried an 8" puller but couldn't get the puller "arms" behind the clutch due to clearance.  I'm also waiting for a new part to get the helix back on, I was using a hacked up hole saw but it's not working for reassembly so I bit the bullet and ordered something.
You can move them around and it may help even-up the wear. Do polish them up and the ramps as well though...polishing compound not sand paper. After doing so I rub-on a little coat of weapons grade graphite and lightly blow-off any loose or excess...you don't want any of that anywhere near the belt...lol. Others have had problems getting that rear sheave off too. I don't have an answer as it should just slide off per the looks of the parts breakdown. Don't use an outside puller...maybe there is a special puller for it. Check the service manual. I never heard of CFM using a Carlisle belt...only Mitsuboshi. Most of us now use either Ultimax or Gates for replacements as the OE belts are way over priced. Interesting note- from what I've been told, Timken bought Carlisle's belt division...made some changes and renamed it "Ultimax"

How are the Gates' holding up long term?  I saw one person on youtube say it shredded in 500 miles but who knows what was really going on.
I got mine all back together and so far it is working!  Clocked to C1 and can notice a much smoother engagement and less jerk when applying throttle.  Hoping this belt lasts me a bit longer.  Thanks for all your advice!  Oh, and I need to get a better tool for holding the primary when tightening, ended up using a block of wood wedged from the frame under the battery, not the best option but it got me to 80ft. lbs!

Bobcat 72

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Has anyone used EPI severe duty belts?
2019 ZForce 800EX