[CCALF]

Thanks for your advice. I'm gonna have a hard time tomorrow paying this guy anything.. Especially $1000 dollars for not even solving the issue.

I know we are going to get into it. Claims he spent 30 hours on the machine with no results... I'm no mechanic, but I had feeling this guy was lieing from the jump.

Over a month and a half at the dealership and the day I call to check on the machine is the day he starts working on it.....

[ctdls]

I don't have time to go back & read the entire thread. I do remember you using starting fluid which may have ramification's with mechanical problems adding to what ever is wrong......

You can have an difference between leak down & compression if the valve timing is incorrect, I've seen this first hand a ZF 800.

Your servicing dealer/mechanic sounds terrible, not new in the CFMOTO world. The guys on the tools need to be above average when working on this product because the support from the manufacturer is less than average.

I'm in agreement with you that you cannot believe anything they said they have done. All diagnostic's will have to repeated as you have no solid answer as what the problem or problems may be.

[REDRIDER]

No way a top end will cost $6000. They are insane.  Legally you only have to pay for what you signed for. If you never signed for, or gave approval for $1000 to be spent you would likely win a court case.  Starting fluid would not cause this being used a couple times. The 600 miles spend in dusty conditions with a stock air filter would be the cause here if it really does need a top end. Any tech worth a damn would have tested compression and leakdown before swapping out a bunch of parts trying to be a parts changer. First 3 checks are always, spark, fuel, and compression.

[NMKawierider]

I think I would fight this and take this dealer and issue straight to CFMoto and do some demanding.

[CCALF]

update: went down to look at the top end today and it does look like it could use a rebuild. values on cylinder 1 and extremely black with carbon deposits. he has the entire machine torn to pieces and says its gonna take 4 more hours of labor to put back together...….. I have talked to multiple mechanics and they all say that filter oil would not have caused this issue.

In the mean time ive called around to other shops and they are saying a rebuild should be $3000 tops depending on how much parts cost. CFMOTO dealer says my machine is the "worst hes ever seen". bullshit I cleaned the filter after every ride.... I will be on the phone tomorrow with CFMOTO. From what I have read they are aware of the air filter issue and yet have done nothing about it. I also have talked with multiple mechanics and they all said filter oil would not have caused this issue.

I will post results tomorrow from what I hear from CFMOTO. I will take NMKawierider's suggestion and demand something... something really needs to be done about this. I mean jezz its a 2017 with 900 miles...….

[REDRIDER]

update: went down to look at the top end today and it does look like it could use a rebuild. values on cylinder 1 and extremely black with carbon deposits. he has the entire machine torn to pieces and says its gonna take 4 more hours of labor to put back together...….. I have talked to multiple mechanics and they all say that filter oil would not have caused this issue.

In the mean time ive called around to other shops and they are saying a rebuild should be $3000 tops depending on how much parts cost. CFMOTO dealer says my machine is the "worst hes ever seen". bullshit I cleaned the filter after every ride.... I will be on the phone tomorrow with CFMOTO. From what I have read they are aware of the air filter issue and yet have done nothing about it. I also have talked with multiple mechanics and they all said filter oil would not have caused this issue.

I will post results tomorrow from what I hear from CFMOTO. I will take NMKawierider's suggestion and demand something... something really needs to be done about this. I mean jezz its a 2017 with 900 miles...….

Filter oil would not cause loss of compression they are right. It is likely due to the 600 miles ingesting too much dirt from the crap stock filters. They know they have a problem since they changed them starting in 2017 or 2018

[CCALF]

Spoke with Nflow. They are going to completely rebuild the engine for $2900 this includes shipping and handeling both ways. They also offer a 6 month warranty and an extended 6 months warranty for $500 extra.

I will be sending my engine back to Nflow for a complete rebuild.. They seem legit and also beef up and clean the engine extremely well.

I called Cfmoto and bitched for over 30 minutes and they said "take up with the the dealer"...

I will be writing reviews for these machines and their poor air intake design. When i get the machine repaired i will be running two airfilters to insure so engine damage. I advise everyone else to do the same or you'll be in the same boat.

Thanks for all the help guys. I'll keep ypu posted on Nflow customer care and how everything else works out.  👍

[NMKawierider]

Spoke with Nflow. They are going to completely rebuild the engine for $2900 this includes shipping and handeling both ways. They also offer a 6 month warranty and an extended 6 months warranty for $500 extra.

I will be sending my engine back to Nflow for a complete rebuild.. They seem legit and also beef up and clean the engine extremely well.

I called Cfmoto and bitched for over 30 minutes and they said "take up with the the dealer"...

I will be writing reviews for these machines and their poor air intake design. When i get the machine repaired i will be running two airfilters to insure so engine damage. I advise everyone else to do the same or you'll be in the same boat.

Thanks for all the help guys. I'll keep ypu posted on Nflow customer care and how everything else works out.  👍

Nflow has done engines for me in the past and many people I know. They are always perfect and I fully trust them. They will be doing mine when the time comes.

[CCALF]

How hard would it be to drop the engine in on my own?

I told the mechanic I was going with Nflow and he got an attitude "saying he ant packing it or nothing".

Omly reason I told him was because hes got the entire machine already apart. This is a god damn joke. I'm paying this guy 1,000 dollars, nothing is fixed he cant even pack the freaking engine on a skid for me....

[REDRIDER]

How hard would it be to drop the engine in on my own?

I told the mechanic I was going with Nflow and he got an attitude "saying he ant packing it or nothing".

Omly reason I told him was because hes got the entire machine already apart. This is a god damn joke. I'm paying this guy 1,000 dollars, nothing is fixed he cant even pack the freaking engine on a skid for me....

Make sure you write a nice long write up online for them and maybe on their facebook page as well. Again unless you authorized them to spend your money before they did all that "work" they are entitled to nothing.

[ctdls]

update: went down to look at the top end today and it does look like it could use a rebuild. values on cylinder 1 and extremely black with carbon deposits. he has the entire machine torn to pieces

Deposit's on the valves is normal as it is when you have combustion, you will see deposit's on the tops of the pistons & exhaust port.......all pretty normal. By chance did he show you excessive blow by underneath the piston rings......I will guess no.

My point here a visual inspection to the untrained eye is not a good determination if it is in need of a rebuild. Go back to your discrepancy of the leak down vs compression test....there needs to be an explanation.

Your back yard guy should have consulted you prior to tear down plan and simple. Myself I would not trust them to re assemble the unit, most likely you will have more issue's than you already have. Nor would I accept the unit back after the unauthorized tear down.

What a mess from were it started to this point.

[CCALF]

update: went down to look at the top end today and it does look like it could use a rebuild. values on cylinder 1 and extremely black with carbon deposits. he has the entire machine torn to pieces

Deposit's on the valves is normal as it is when you have combustion, you will see deposit's on the tops of the pistons & exhaust port.......all pretty normal. By chance did he show you excessive blow by underneath the piston rings......I will guess no.

My point here a visual inspection to the untrained eye is not a good determination if it is in need of a rebuild. Go back to your discrepancy of the leak down vs compression test....there needs to be an explanation.

Your back yard guy should have consulted you prior to tear down plan and simple. Myself I would not trust them to re assemble the unit, most likely you will have more issue's than you already have. Nor would I accept the unit back after the unauthorized tear down.

What a mess from were it started to this point.

He did show me "what looked like" the blow by. Like you said, I do have an untrained eye but I was somewhat educated before I went down to look at it.

My fingers are crossed that the engine was put back together correctly.... I'm hoping that when I send it to NFLOW they will be able to fix it up really nice.

When i get the engine back i will have someone else reinstall.  I Will be running double filters also and make sure I take extremely good care of the machine.

I also thought about selling the machine for $3,000 and letting someone else mess with it. At this price someone could get a machine with a rebuilt engine for around $6,000 if they can do the work themselves.

I had it with that dealer. The owner " told me to come down and get my machine off his property" because "I went behind his back and called Nflow"...

Im not the kinda guy that wouldnt pay... I did although expect them to throw the engine on a skid and send it to Nflow for me. I guess after spending 900 dollars and 2 months with nothing fixed that was too much to ask.

[REDRIDER]

This place is a real piece of work. Pissed off because you won't spend $6000 for them to rebuild a top end which someone could do for about $500 in parts and machine work (rough estimate) even paying a decent shop would cost maybe $1k-$1500.. It's your fault that they are thieves and are ridiculously over priced and screwing you over? It's your fault that the tech took 30 hours to check the first 3 things to you ALWAYS check when diagnosing a no start? spark, fuel, compression/leakdown test. Is this a dealer or an independent shop? Please let us know the name of the place so we can steer anyone clear of it. I am not fully convinced it even needs an engine. It sounds like they priced in replacing a bunch of other parts including an engine in case they are wrong with the top end rebuild, or fuck it up when they do it.

[doug80638]

Based on what I've read, this thing went badly sideways because of the mechanic. Swapping parts without diagnosing the failure first is a sure sign of incompetence.

Nothing in the initial problem description indicated the need for a rebuild of any type. It passed a compression test so it SHOULD have been possible to get it firing and running regardless of any leakdown issue (sans a timing chain jump).

Blow-by isn't something you "see". Every engine has blow-by. You can test the amount of blow-by by measuring crankcase pressures, but the engine needs to be running. Even engines with sever wear will run with high levels of blow-by. That's what the crankcase breather is for. Concerns for excessive blow-by would be cracked cases and blown head gaskets that allow gases to escape through paths other than the piston rings, not likely in an engine with good compression.

I feel so bad for the owner getting abused by this mechanic/company. He's making the right decision to pull the job from them to cut his losses. I've had bad mechanics cost me money in the past, so I feel his pain.

If they disassembled the engine without permission (something signed) it may be worth chasing the money after the cause of the failure is determined by a competent mechanic.

[NMKawierider]

This has to be one of the worst shop stories I've heard in a long time. It's experiences like this that gives a bad wrap to all the powersports industry, not just CFMoto.