0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

? On carbon fiber air intake
« on: April 17, 2016, 12:49:01 PM »
For the guys changing to this what r u doing with the black hose that's tied into the factory box are u plumbing it in or just plugging it off?? Thanks I just started my new snorkel and just seen that

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #1 on: April 17, 2016, 03:32:46 PM »
Here's what I have so far and there's a pic of the hose any ideas on the hose

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #2 on: April 17, 2016, 04:29:22 PM »
Oh that's the crankcase vent and it has to be ported into the intake somehow. It's the only breather it has. I would just get a saddle with a 1/2" (or whatever it is) for the intake pipe with barbed nipple to slip it onto. Funny thing is on other machines..like my Brute Force, it is ported inside the air filter area so as it pulses it can't bring dirt in.. but on the CFMoto, its on the outside on the cover and it will pull in dust and dirt. Fortunately it blows out more then it sucks in.  You have the opportunity to make that breather breath filtered air..like it should.

What size of pipe did you use on the intake and I'll try a find a saddle for you.
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #3 on: April 17, 2016, 05:09:28 PM »
I used 2" for everything. Thanks for the quick info and help

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #4 on: April 17, 2016, 05:49:39 PM »
I used 2" for everything. Thanks for the quick info and help

I'll see what I can find. Might get one where you got the pipe though. And I would put it just after the 90 on the upright section.
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

*

Offline wexy21

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #5 on: April 17, 2016, 06:19:08 PM »
I tapped in right here.  The hose is long enough and I used a brass screw in hose connecter found at any hardware store.  Pretty simple, I just drilled into the rubber gasket and carbon fiber tube and then screwed it in. 

I like your elbow and piping underneath going to the throttle body, where did you get that?







14 Cfmoto 800EX
06 CR 500AF
04 KTM 125SX
88 CR 250

*

Offline wexy21

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #6 on: April 17, 2016, 06:22:02 PM »
Oh, and I would definitely get a pre-filter for yours.  These Ebay can filters are pretty junky in my opinion, and the filters do not come off of the tubing so they can't be replaced.  I don't like how the tip of the cone filter is open with only a screen mesh covering that opening.  It almost defeats the whole purpose of the filter itself.   I'm going with something better soon. 
14 Cfmoto 800EX
06 CR 500AF
04 KTM 125SX
88 CR 250

*

emersonsc

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #7 on: April 18, 2016, 07:58:51 AM »
I tapped in right here.  The hose is long enough and I used a brass screw in hose connecter found at any hardware store.  Pretty simple, I just drilled into the rubber gasket and carbon fiber tube and then screwed it in. 

I like your elbow and piping underneath going to the throttle body, where did you get that?







Wow!! Nice!

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #8 on: April 18, 2016, 08:11:13 AM »
If there is a question about that filter, fix it at any expense. Ensure nothing gets through to the engine except pure, cool air.

Here's another interesting thought about volume..and yes, maybe a rambling but I need to unload it so I can move on  :) :

With no intake or exhaust restrictions, An 800 CC engine running at..well lets say for ease of calculations, 8000 rpm will flow 6,400,000.00 ccs of air every minute. That's 106,666.66 ccs every second. That's minimum so lets add 10% to give us some room for a dirty filter..10,666.66. So in theory, we need a filter and intake system that can flow 117,333.32 ccs of air every second. Sounds like a lot of air....and it is. Now we need specs on filters and their surface flow rates per inch/centimeter and some airbox specs to get it right. Yes, this is overkill as there is much restriction in exhaust and intake and the FI system is tuned for this as part of the EPA requirements but..wouldn't it be nice to know and have exactly what it needed..to have it right for this engine? Intake restriction, in order to remain a constant must be part of the airbox or piping design and never the filter as it's flow rate changes with every mile of dusty roads. So the filter must be sized large enough not to effect flow rate for a reasonable amount of time. And from my observations, most stock filters of 800cc & larger engines are larger..or have more surface area then the stock CFMoto 800 filter even with it's pleats. This has always concerned me as when you force higher volumes of air through smaller surface areas, you loose filtration as things are just forced through where the slower the flow of air per surface square inch better entrapment happens. It's this thought that makes me think this is why partials get through the stock CFMoto paper filter. It just does not have enough surface area for the volume it's pulling through. The UniFilter or Twinair filters filter and capture better by design of their filter media, but actually have less surface area then the stock filter as they have no pleating. Have you seen the paper filter they put in a Polaris 800 or 900? Much larger then any CFMoto.

OK, rambling over...probably over thinking this anyway but food for thought for those re-designing the air intake system on these.

One more thought and then I'll be quiet.

On this system we now have the crankcase vent on the filtered air side where most other manufacturers have them..but, if the filter is restrictive, this means increased vacuum between the filter and throttle body which also means increased vacuum on the crankcase. I have seen where increased vacuum on a crankcase pulls additional blow-by past the rings causing oil on the cylinders to migrate away from the two surfaces...causing accelerated wear. It also can so the same on main seals if it's high enough. You may want to test it with a low-level vacuum or water gauge to ensure there is no readable vacuum on the crankcase at high RPM. Remember originally they had it tapped to the outside of the filtered air area in the box where it would never get any real vacuum, just pulsed and exhausted in the box.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2016, 09:48:42 AM by NMKawierider »
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #9 on: April 18, 2016, 09:26:18 AM »
just curious what you all did with the plastic fan on the right side of the engine that cools the exhaust? did you just eliminate it or leave it i cant see snorkeling it too or maybe you did?
2012 Z6 trail
Homemade roof/Stereo system/KFI Snowplow/3 inch lift/28 inch maxxis bighorn 2.0/led running lights/thats it no more mods until i get the 800ex/wrong custom skid plate

*

Offline wexy21

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #10 on: April 18, 2016, 05:44:03 PM »
I didn't do anything to the fan intake...it was left alone. 

I also thought about where to put the crankcase vent (before or after the filter), and since the original air box collected so much dust I couldn't stand leaving that vent before the filter. 

Also on the amount of volume these motors need...I think that the original design is very restrictive so this aftermarket canister and filter should be providing more than stock and with better filtration.  Adding the prefilter should eliminate any water or dust going through its design flaw.  But if not, that can always be sealed shut. 

I'll be taking the intake a part this week to inspect the throttle body and tubing for small particles.  I've also been thinking of a way to collect any water that might get past the filter by making a down tube in the piping much like a trap for sinks.
14 Cfmoto 800EX
06 CR 500AF
04 KTM 125SX
88 CR 250

*

Offline wexy21

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #11 on: April 18, 2016, 09:09:27 PM »
So I just took the intake off for an inspection and found that the crank case hose definitely needs to be either routed to intake BEFORE the air filter, or have its own breather.  There was oily dirt in my intake and throttle body.  I ended up taking the throttle body intake manifold and injectors out for a good cleaning.   I'm going to use a small cone filter for the crank case breather and tuck that away in a clean place, then redo the part of the tubing that is flexible with some more durable stuff.  I also found some small holes in that, so I'm glad I found all of this out now rather than later. 
14 Cfmoto 800EX
06 CR 500AF
04 KTM 125SX
88 CR 250

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #12 on: April 18, 2016, 09:21:40 PM »
Sounds like a plan. Yeah that was the other concern...oil mist getting to the throttle body.
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #13 on: April 18, 2016, 10:34:04 PM »
Yeah I figured that would happen if u put it in after the filter I also thought about just putting a filter on that hose myself but I wouldn't think you should b getting that much blow by on that new of a machine but you never know I'm just used to old Chevy motors we always rounted that crank case vent tube to are headers

*

Offline wexy21

Re: ? On carbon fiber air intake
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2016, 07:32:59 PM »
I finished the snorkel mod today.  It really looks good this way and after testing it out seems to be holding up fine.   I simplified the connections and pieces which will make it more durable.  It really only took a few parts to make this and was easy to do.   I did buy 8 of those 5" rubber gromets you see in my bed.  I will put the rest of sale on ebay, or here if anyone wants one.  I didn't know how many it would take me to ruin before completing this. 

The crank case breather filter is one off of my Buell, which is stock so I know that will work just fine.  I will just have to make sure it's clean between rides in case it gets covered in mud.  If that becomes an issue I'll just route it somewhere else. 

















Didn't mean to take this thread over, but it makes it easier to have one thread posting about this vrs several.   :)
14 Cfmoto 800EX
06 CR 500AF
04 KTM 125SX
88 CR 250