0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

*

Offline emersonsc

Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« on: November 13, 2016, 08:14:22 AM »
Finally got my rig back together after motor #3 exploded the #1 piston.

Went out last night in her maiden voyage. Battery was dead 3/4 of the way back.

This battery has left me stranded before, so my guess is even though it's testing good, it's junk or on its way out. Tested the stator, it's charging as it should. The accessories I have now are no different than before.

My question:

Do I go with a dual battery set up and an isolator, or a lithium battery?

With a dual battery, where on God's green earth do I put it? The old battery location under the seat isn't big enough to out another 30BS in there.

I hear lithium don't have the same aH as a lead acid, is this true?


*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #1 on: November 13, 2016, 09:00:19 AM »
You can get a lithium batteries with higher CCAs and Ahs then a lead-acid batters. I did that with my Brute when I added power steering and needed extra to get me through tight long trails as the charging system doesn't change and that extra 30 amps pulls the life out of a battery. With that said, its been a great battery over the years for a 180-dollar battery but you have to be careful...careful how you charge and maintain it....carful about short periods of high loads. It weighs nothing.. which is great for an ATV and properly taken care of they will last a very long time...but are they worth it for a UTV? My personal opinion is...no. When the time comes I will replace mine with either the same or one with most CCAs and Ahs as I can get for the size I can put back in there. And maybe get a smaller one for the extra compartment with an isolator but for now I have no need for that extra one..or the added weight.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2016, 09:02:27 AM by NMKawierider »
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

*

Offline emersonsc

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #2 on: November 13, 2016, 09:03:31 AM »
You can get a lithium batters with higher CCAs and Ahs then a lead-acid batters. I did that with my Brute when I added power steering and needed extra to get me through tight long trails as the charging system doesn't change and that extra 30 amps pulls the life out of a battery. With that said, its been a great battery over the years for a 180-dollar batters but you have to be careful...careful how you charge and maintain it....carful about short periods of high loads. It weighs nothing which is great for an ATV and properly taken care of they will last a very long time...but are they worth it for a UTV? My personal opinion is...no, when the time comes I will replace mine with either the same or one with most CCAs and Ahs as I can get for the size I can put back in there. And maybe get a smaller one for the extra compartment with an isolator but for now I have no need for that extra one..or the added weight.

Is it ok to run a smaller battery? I thought you had to have matching batteries when running in a series? Or does the idolator allow you to use different batteries?

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #3 on: November 13, 2016, 09:22:08 AM »
Oh yeah is always OK to run different sizes of batteries together just not different voltages like a 12V and a 6V. When run in parallel their total is combined and act as one 12V battery.. during both charging and discharging. The same is true for "series" however during pull-down the smaller battery will show more depleted then the larger one when separated where they show the same when in parallel. But yeah it's fine.
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

*

Offline emersonsc

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #4 on: November 13, 2016, 09:24:59 AM »
Oh yeah is always OK to run different sizes of batteries together just not different voltages like a 12V and a 6V. When run in parallel their total is combined and act as one 12V battery.. during both charging and discharging. The same is true for "series" however during pull-down the smaller battery will show more depleted then the larger one when separated where they show the same when in parallel. But yeah it's fine.

Perfect! Thank you.

Do you recommend the use of an isolator?

I'm wondering if I can get away with a smaller battery (under the seat) for starting only, and having the larger (stock battery) run everything else and use an isolator to make sure the starting battery is untouched except for starting purposes.

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #5 on: November 13, 2016, 09:43:07 AM »
Oh yeah is always OK to run different sizes of batteries together just not different voltages like a 12V and a 6V. When run in parallel their total is combined and act as one 12V battery.. during both charging and discharging. The same is true for "series" however during pull-down the smaller battery will show more depleted then the larger one when separated where they show the same when in parallel. But yeah it's fine.

Perfect! Thank you.

Do you recommend the use of an isolator?

I'm wondering if I can get away with a smaller battery (under the seat) for starting only, and having the larger (stock battery) run everything else and use an isolator to make sure the starting battery is untouched except for starting purposes.
Well, how much load is on your battery from extra things? During running they both have to be together in order for the system to charge them. If your load exceeds the stator or charging system output, like my PS did on my ATV, it will just be a matter of time before both are drained. The extra battery just gives you some more time...it also takes longer to charge two dead batteries back up. Hard to know which way to go but here's the way I look at it:

The accessory circuit is for extras. It is fused with a 10amp fuse (as I recall) which is a safe amount of extra load above and beyond all the rest of the factory installed items.. except the wench. If I use that circuit and keep my loads below that limit, I should have no problems with the electrical system or the battery. I do this and have had no problems so far. Now, there may be a little more I can get out of the stator but I have not needed it yet and so far my max load on the acc circuit is 6.8amps even with the 24" light bar on.
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

*

Offline bezerk1

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #6 on: November 13, 2016, 12:39:30 PM »
Have you ever thought of mounting a battery under the hood?  Or maybe mounting a battery under the hood insert?

*

Offline emersonsc

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #7 on: November 13, 2016, 01:15:26 PM »
Have you ever thought of mounting a battery under the hood?  Or maybe mounting a battery under the hood insert?

I thought about it, but I want to keep the battery as close to the stock battery and voltage regulator as I can

*

Offline emersonsc

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #8 on: November 13, 2016, 01:31:39 PM »
Well, how much load is on your battery from extra things? During running they both have to be together in order for the system to charge them. If your load exceeds the stator or charging system output, like my PS did on my ATV, it will just be a matter of time before both are drained. The extra battery just gives you some more time...it also takes longer to charge two dead batteries back up. Hard to know which way to go but here's the way I look at it:

The accessory circuit is for extras. It is fused with a 10amp fuse (as I recall) which is a safe amount of extra load above and beyond all the rest of the factory installed items.. except the wench. If I use that circuit and keep my loads below that limit, I should have no problems with the electrical system or the battery. I do this and have had no problems so far. Now, there may be a little more I can get out of the stator but I have not needed it yet and so far my max load on the acc circuit is 6.8amps even with the 24" light bar on.
[/quote]

An isolator allows both batteries to charge, while blocking drain from accessories attached to the opposite battery.

The problem I'm finding is, the charging wire from the voltage regulator shares a common hot lead that runs to the other accessories AND connects to the battery.

I COULD snip the line from the regulator that goes into the harness, and run it directly to the charging post on the isolator, but I'm not sure I want to hack up the wiring harness.

*

Offline murdo

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #9 on: November 13, 2016, 01:55:35 PM »
I've not had much success with the Lithium in my bikes and have gone back to the AGM Motobatt.
Found the Lithium would be good so far, then it would just die and hardly enough to light the dash until charged (and you need a special charger for them too).

*

Offline chuddly

Re: Dual Battery VS Lightweight Lithium
« Reply #10 on: November 14, 2016, 08:22:27 AM »
Emerson and I talked via text last night about this but I will add in my set up for those that are interested.  I am running dual batteries.  Both batteries are the same and I have an isolator between them.  I have my second battery wired to run all of my accessories and my main battery is for running the machine its self. The isolator/separator I run is bi-directional so if the main battery goes bad it saves the secondary one to get you home.  If the secondary one goes bad or is used up by the accessories it separates it from the main so you can run it and get home.  This insolator/separator also has a "start boost" feature that you can run a wire from your "start" position on your key and when you go to start your machine it automatically connects the 2 batteries to give you the full benefit of the 2 batteries.  Below is the battery isolator I use and also a crappy diagram of how I wire mine (it is very basic and only shows the main power feeds but you get the idea).  I ran this same set up on my last SxS for over 3 years and it never left me stranded.

http://www.allbatterysalesandservice.com/browse.cfm/4,2706.html


I can imagine a world completely at peace.  A world where there are no weapons, no war, and no violence at all.  And I can imagine us taking over that world because they would never expect it.