0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

*

Offline ThatATVguy

High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« on: June 24, 2016, 09:21:23 PM »
Hi all,
So after my 800 was sitting for 2 or 3 weeks, I took it out for a much deserved ride. But almost right away I noticed something was up.
Before I had no issue hitting 70kph (43mph) or higher without the engine noticeably revving high, but today, I was hitting about 60kph (37mph) and the engine was revving 6000+rpm in high. If I pushed it to 70kph it revved between 7000-7500rpm. Just to make sure it wasn't just the shifter way out of adjustment and I was actually in low by mistake, I put the shifter in the low position, and I could only do 30kph (19mph) without starting to worry about pushing the motor too hard, it was probably revving close to 7000rpm if I started getting closer to 40kph (25mph).
Other than the high RPM's, it drove great!

Hopefully this somewhat makes sense to you guys, I tend to ramble when I have an issue haha.

I've heard about the different settings in the secondary clutch, maybe this somehow adjusted itself or something?
Any help would be appreciated!

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #1 on: June 24, 2016, 09:31:44 PM »
Has to be something with one of the clutches. I guess it has to come apart to see what.
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

*

Offline ThatATVguy

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #2 on: June 24, 2016, 09:47:39 PM »
Has to be something with one of the clutches. I guess it has to come apart to see what.

Definitely, hoping it's just that the secondary somehow changed it's setting. That would probably be my first guess, as it drove completely normal, no weird noises or jerky engagement, just high RPM. I'll make sure to keep everyone posted at what I find.

*

Offline gfmoto

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #3 on: June 24, 2016, 10:24:30 PM »
Don't think you'll be seeing a "self adjusting" secondary.
NMKawierider , stupid question, but could a roller get stuck or something?
2015 ZForce 800EX
32" light bar
2-4" spots
Custom Cv guards
DIY 1/2 windshield
UNI air filter
DIY rear window
BOSS ATV 28. 450W speakers
Alpena Rock Lights (tough pods)
2" RZR Bracket lift
Roof extensions
27" Maxxis Corranado Tires
Alpena RGB rock lights
SuperATV Rocksliders
1/2 Doors w/custom paint and graphics

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #4 on: June 24, 2016, 10:51:37 PM »
Don't think you'll be seeing a "self adjusting" secondary.
NMKawierider , stupid question, but could a roller get stuck or something?
Well..with as much dirt and other crap that can flow through these CVT systems, most anything is possible. Get some dust and dirt buildup and add a little water, then let it sit a week and dry out..yeah I would think anything is possible. Not a big fan of the pad and ramp system they have on the secondary either. Scars easily and looks like it could bind as well.
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2016, 11:32:32 PM »
My guess is the primary is stuck. NMK's theory makes sounds about right to me.
2015 ZForce 800EX EPS
Two Bros. slip-on
Snorkels
Half windshield
30" Monster mayhems on STI HD2s
2" lift
Secondary clocked to C4
1mm Primary Shim 3.25:1 Lowest Ratio
More to come

*

Offline ThatATVguy

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #6 on: June 26, 2016, 08:15:35 AM »
If the primary was stuck, would that mean that the belt would have its full range of motion on the secondary but not on the primary, which would limit the higher gear ratios, correct? I'm just trying to understand some of this better before I go tearing into it.

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #7 on: June 26, 2016, 08:40:20 AM »
If the primary was stuck, would that mean that the belt would have its full range of motion on the secondary but not on the primary, which would limit the higher gear ratios, correct? I'm just trying to understand some of this better before I go tearing into it.
If either was stuck or binding for some reason it would stop or limit the shift-out so it would act like it was in low range..kinda. The other thing that can happen is belt slippage due to a bad belt or bad area in one of the sheaves so take a look there too. On the secondary, use one of the cover bolts to spread the sheaves and if it does easily, then that clutch is OK.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2016, 08:42:26 AM by NMKawierider »
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

*

Offline ThatATVguy

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #8 on: June 26, 2016, 05:18:26 PM »
If the primary was stuck, would that mean that the belt would have its full range of motion on the secondary but not on the primary, which would limit the higher gear ratios, correct? I'm just trying to understand some of this better before I go tearing into it.
If either was stuck or binding for some reason it would stop or limit the shift-out so it would act like it was in low range..kinda. The other thing that can happen is belt slippage due to a bad belt or bad area in one of the sheaves so take a look there too. On the secondary, use one of the cover bolts to spread the sheaves and if it does easily, then that clutch is OK.

Ok, thanks for the advise!
How can I check if the primary is stuck or binding?

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #9 on: June 26, 2016, 05:23:18 PM »
If the primary was stuck, would that mean that the belt would have its full range of motion on the secondary but not on the primary, which would limit the higher gear ratios, correct? I'm just trying to understand some of this better before I go tearing into it.
If either was stuck or binding for some reason it would stop or limit the shift-out so it would act like it was in low range..kinda. The other thing that can happen is belt slippage due to a bad belt or bad area in one of the sheaves so take a look there too. On the secondary, use one of the cover bolts to spread the sheaves and if it does easily, then that clutch is OK.

Ok, thanks for the advise!
How can I check if the primary is stuck or binding?
Just take the cap off, slip the belt out of the way and remove it completely...clean it up and inspect it. Then check the specs on the belt...then look to the secondary.
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #10 on: June 27, 2016, 02:11:56 AM »
You can take the cover off. Then start the engine in park or neutral and give it some gas. If it's working right, you'll see the pulleys move with the RPM. The belt will change from small diameter on the primary and large on the secondary, to about the same on both pulleys. Do it at your own risk though, it could be dangerous.
2015 ZForce 800EX EPS
Two Bros. slip-on
Snorkels
Half windshield
30" Monster mayhems on STI HD2s
2" lift
Secondary clocked to C4
1mm Primary Shim 3.25:1 Lowest Ratio
More to come

*

Offline Cosmosdan

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #11 on: June 27, 2016, 02:17:20 AM »
No running with the cover off. The primary shaft is supported by the bearing in the cover. You will trash the inboard bearing when you side load it like that.
2013 Z6 Trail
Iron Baltic skid plates
UE Boom Speaker mount
RZR 800 Shocks
Mostly stock trail riding
25g. Rollers and A1

2016 Outlander max 570
Too new for mods yet

*

Offline ThatATVguy

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #12 on: June 27, 2016, 12:17:55 PM »
Ok, so I just got the cover off, and right away something definitely isn't right on the primary clutch.
A good portion of the sheaves are scuffed and scratched, which I would assume would not let the belt transition smoothly, or at all.
Sorry for the bad pictures, it's hard to get a phone in there for a picture.
I assume the sheaves need to be cleaned... But is that all that needs to be done? I'm probably going to end up taking it all apart and checking the belt, and maybe adjusting the secondary spring now that I'm part way in there.

*

Offline NMKawierider

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #13 on: June 27, 2016, 02:23:14 PM »
Not enough photos to tell but it has not been shifting all the way out and there are signs of belt slippage. I suspect there is a problem with the sheaves and/or belt but one pic won't tell is the complete story and...it might not be the primary that is stopping it from full shift out so plan on complete disassembly ..both clutches. Take tons of pics...every angle. Also, that streaking at the top, if it wipes off with some cleaner like acetone, it may be oil from the shaft seal and that could be the real problem so take a very good look at that. And remember, when you put it back together, NO greases or oils. Use nothing...well, you can use a dry lube like graphite but you must blow and wipe down the excess dust to ensure it can not get between the belt and sheave contact surfaces.

And if that proves to be oil, toss the belt...its no good any more. Same if it looks like it was slipping...which is does.
« Last Edit: June 27, 2016, 02:30:30 PM by NMKawierider »
2015 Z Force 800 (53") EPS -
Custom Air Intakes | Custom Exhaust Mod | SuperATV Harness | Custom Fenders | Custom Skid/Rock Sliders | 27" GBC Grim Reapers | Seizmik Mirrors |Конструктор (Rodin's) Doors | Dr Pulley Sliders | 1.5" Wheel Spacers | BENZ Silencer (as needed) | SATV Flip Windshield W\ Rear Shield | Dual Light Bars | Diamond Plate Storage | 9.7" GPS | Bandit Springs Rear & Gen-3 Shocks Front

My Videos On YouTube

*

Offline ThatATVguy

Re: High engine RPM? Clutching changed?
« Reply #14 on: June 27, 2016, 04:20:32 PM »
So I went and talked to my dealer, and he said to take it in and it would be covered under warranty, so that's what I did. I'll make sure to post what the problem turns out to be, as it might help someone else with a similar issue.
Thanks for all of the pointers up to this point!